, in order to protect small businesses and our economy. instead, new revenue would be generated through progrowth tax reform that closes special interest loopholes and deduksz while lowering rates. i'm going to guess that is the very line that the white house is going to say no deal to, right? >> so let me understand. if, in fact, we want $800 billion in new revenues, and we can do that through closing loopholes, limiting deductions for the wealthy in this country, and we're going to not have a deal because it's not a rate increase, but rather taking the same amount of money from the same people and we're going to say no to that? >> well, there are people who said, the math doesn't work out. closing the loopholes doesn't get you enough money. >> soledad, i've been studying this for seven years. that's bologna. there's -- it's easy to get $800 billion out of the wealthy in this country by limiting deductions and taking away options that are specifically benefiting only the well off in this country. >> case, but -- >> all you have to do is -- for example, people making more than $250,000